In a special episode of our podcast, RJ and Lou bring on a good friend of theirs, Frank Guirlinger, to tell his story.
In 2005, Frank was living the American dream, working with in real estate development, building a seven-figure nest egg for he, his wife, and their two children.
One day, he started having neck pain, which he attributed to long hours and hard physical work. Then, one morning he collapsed and couldn't move. He had a spinal cord infection, an abscess in the C3 area of his neck. He ended up at DMC Hospital in Detroit. He later found out that, at the time, doctors gave him a 25% chance of surviving surgery. And they believed if he did, he'd be paralyzed and never even be able to lift a finger.
But as he's always done, Frank kept fighting. This included being unable to move, having to be intubated with pneumonia, and spending 40 days feeling like he was drowning. But he improved, and was able to be moved to a facility in Ann Arbor.
After being released, Frank went through more rehab, eventually running out of money. He didn't want to ask for help, but was left with no choice. But he continued to improve, weaning himself off of narcotics, and treating his pain and injuries with more holistic methods. Today, he's able to move around, drive, and has most of his motor function back.
The last step in Frank's recovery is a trip to Panama for a stem cell transplant, which he hopes will alleviate more of his chronic pain. He has a website where you can learn more.
https://helphopelive.org/campaign/16189/
RJ
Hello, Lou.
Lou
RJ, how are you?
RJ
Good. Well, we have a special podcast today. Lou, if you could introduce our guest.
Lou
Thanks RJ. Today it's a little different than our normal podcasts that we've run. I felt compelled to bring in a longtime friend of mine to tell his story of his challenges, and I would call "future triumphs" that he's been battling with over the last 7-8 years. And I think the audience would definitely like to hear about it with Frank Guirlinger.
Frank
RJ and Lou, thanks for making the time today and letting me get out and tell my story and hopefully, recruit some people behind it to helping across the finish line of the recovery I'm working on.
RJ
Frank, it's great to see you. I've known you for more than 15 years, and you've been very active in Metro Detroit in terms of real estate development and all different types of activities before you were paralyzed. What was your life like? If you could give us some insight into your work life, at home, your spiritual and social aspects of your life.
Frank
I had a career with Sterling group and Gary Targow, the term with Todd Sasche. And then I was breaking off to do some of my own work in entrepreneurial efforts in real estate and development. Do what everybody's trying to do to grow a business and young family and very active. I was still out barefoot waterskiing and developing real estate, doing construction, had really big plans and life was coming together. We were living what I would call our little American dream. And I had been working almost 20 hours a day trying to deliver a development for a client in Ann Arbor area. I was hauling appliances in and out even as a part owner of a $40 million company. And I was having some back trouble and I thought well, that's probably a result of me carrying furniture and air for waterskiing and trying to do all these things. I was having some severe back pain.
So I did something that I never did. I went to the doctor, and I was like so proud of myself and the doctor looked at me and gave me some painkillers and some muscle relaxers and told me to go home and get through it. And what they didn't realize was I had a spinal cord infection or an abscess up in my neck, C3 area. The Tylenol and the opioids were masking the fever. And long story short, I got up one morning took about three steps, dropped to the floor in a complete cramp like you'd have when you're completely incapacitated from a hamstring cramp. But just take that from your neck down every single muscle. And I was completely down, I couldn't move, and my son basically called 911.
They trucked me over to the hospital here. Huron Valley Sinai Hospital actually, and it's kind of interesting, because I've done both major additions there as a project superintendent, and they ended up putting me in an MRI that I built, to add to the irony of that thing. But they rather quickly identified this abscess, and they were over their head at Huron Valley and I was completely paralyzed from the neck down. I was in agony. And then one moment I thought maybe they've given me some drugs and knocked the pain but I looked around and I couldn't feel anything. And it was completely surreal. I didn't panic. I was just like, there must be a reason this is happening and this must be reversible. It was just completely surreal. I never I never panicked. They put me in an ambulance. They raced me downtown, and I ended up DMC downtown. My wife called my dear friend, Yoni Torgow, actually, and we had developed the Michigan Orthopedic Institute for Beaumont in Southfield a number of years before I was Sterling group.
So Yoni brought Dr. Kurz who is a very well renowned spinal surgeon, right to my bedside as they were going to roll me into surgery. And my wife was like, she really wanted Dr. Kurz to do this surgery. And Dr. Kurz and Yoni came in and Dr. Kurz said, "Hey, you got to go in right now." And I didn't know then. But if you get one of these, it's like one in four mortality rate. And that's probably if you catch it early. So I was at death's door. And Yoni said have you got your affairs in order? He walked out and said he's going to look after my wife if anything happened. But they didn't look panicked, but it was serious. So they walked out of the room and I didn't hear it until about three years ago Yoni said, Dr. Kurz was like, "If he lives through the surgery it’s going to be a miracle." And then, well, I lived through the surgery. Then Dr. Kurz said, "If he lives through the surgery, he will never move a finger." So I went into the ICU. I spent 40 days in the ICU essentially fighting for my life.
I had two major surgeries. I had titanium and cadaver bones and ended up coming out of the surgeries and got pneumonia. And I spent 40 days basically drowning right on dry land in front of everybody's face, completely unable to move. It was the most traumatizing experience I've ever had in my entire life. I spent 40 days like that with a tracheotomy, all kinds of tubes in me, and I was basically a vegetable. And when I was stabilized, and I was still on oxygen, they moved me over to U of M hospital, after 40 days in the ICU, and I lived. Which seemed to be pretty impressive accomplishment if you talk to Dr. Kurz. In my mind, I was still like, I didn't have a traumatic accident here, there was an infection that squeezed down around my spinal cord, my feeling was that I believe that nerves can heal, and then I would get better. And so we got over to U of M. My expectations were I was thinking because I'm an athlete, and a bodybuilder and a fitness fanatic that I would defeat quadriplegia in like six months. And everybody at the hospital was trying to tell me that this was my new life and that I needed to go to the support group that I needed to get in line with how things were going to be because nobody has enough money to do what you're talking about doing. And nobody recovers from this and all that. And I was like, I wouldn't accept that.
I went to a one year sort of a thing. And I ultimately said, "You guys are 100% successful at being unsuccessful. Why would I listen to you?" And that was the end of it. But I'll say that we spent a good time in U of M. And by the time that I left U of M, and they were terrific, you could probably velcro a toothbrush to my hand and I could occasionally get it in my mouth. So that was after 100 days. And I basically got poured in the electric chair and I could move my right hand to drive me. Now I got to come home. And once we had an active dad at home, that is, carrying the kids out to the boat, doing all kinds of things and bringing home a nice living. And all of a sudden, you're bringing home a vegetable that got home. And you're in diapers, and you’re a 200-pound baby. And your family now, I had my daughter just turned 16 over the weekend. And then my son is going to turn 19 year in April. And they were 11 and 8 years old respectively.
Basically one day they lost their dad for 100 days and then we brought back a body. We were sitting well. We were very fortunate financially and I was sitting on a seven figure plus net worth through some good fortune and good hard work and I was looking at what insurance covered and you usually get about 30 visits of rehabilitation or 60 a year. Depends on what your insurance is. The type of rehabilitation that I needed- you can burn that up in a month. It is very intense, and started to go through the early insurance stuff and went to a rim clinic and know vie for a year. So I started going through the rehab stuff. And I started showing some promise. I ended up going to another rehab clinic that takes people. It's called Walk the Line in Southfield. But it's very expensive treatments. I was spending at some point $900 a session. You got to have three, four people moving around a body. I'm paying for this privately. And I believed that I would absolutely recover just because of my physical fitness background and it's kind of who I am. I'm not going to let somebody tell me I can't do something when I see that there's a path to recover. And I ended up spending seven figures plus, and essentially going broke about three, four years into the recovery. But I was able to from spending all that money, get myself to be able to stand on a walker. It took a lot of hard work. I had to teach myself how to drive. But I exhausted all my financial resources.
We went broke and the lights are going out and we are now experiencing poverty. And that is something that I had never experienced in my lifetime. I had grown up very blessed. My father was very successful. And I had been successful in hard work for myself. So then we got into poverty and handicap and some folks stepped in. I asked for help. And thank God for, like I say, a really big part of the story is just the immense social capital that was invested in me and my family that has produced the results that we've had. And they through a motorcycle rally for me, and we raised about 60 grand from different sources. People came in and contributed, and we were able to fund my recovery further, and get the lights back on and fund my nurse. And through those efforts, I was able to become 100% independent, and not have any nurses getting me up about two years ago. And then COVID popped in. And that created a wrinkle and that I couldn't train conventionally. So instead of just put my head in my hands, I basically invented my own training routine. And I was plateaued with pharmaceuticals.
I had gone down the opioid road for pain control and that's a story of in itself, of getting off that but I brought things completely holistic during COVID. I said, I'm going go to stretching, I'm going to go to yoga, I'm going to essentially get away from anything that I was doing. Oh my god, they had me on antibiotics, they had me on Neurontin and some opioids. And I started to wean myself off of every pharmaceutical and tried to get into some meditations that I looked into by Joe Dispenza. I got hooked up with, I'll say, my shaman and my yogi, a girlfriend of mine from high school that got me headed down the holistic road. And through the COVID process, I got into cannabis for pain management, which helped me a great deal in terms of getting off the opioids. A lot of notable, and I'll say entertaining mistakes with cannabis. I was previously anti cannabis and voted against it.
And then irony seems to love Frank Guirlinger. Now I'm a proponent of that thing. But in any case, they had me on pharmaceuticals and opioids and I ballooned up to about 330 pounds. And I was unable to stop getting bladder infections, so I'd have to eat bad food and stuff.
My wife called up a holistic doctor, and I ended up taking 4000 milligrams of garlic and 1500 milligrams of oregano. And I never had another bladder infection again, and then I got rid of the antibiotics I was on. So that allowed me to start improving my gut health and get my diet together started me on the ability to eat the right foods. So I got into intermittent fasting, ketosis, a lot of strategies that I use as a bodybuilder. I was probably 330 pounds, and I took myself down to 180 in a wheelchair. Once I reduced my weight, and I started to realize the food intake controlled my pain, much more than anything else, I was able to quit opioids which is another story in itself. And I was able to come in and use cannabis and turmeric and other types of holistic substances to manage my pain. Now, I've gotten myself in a position where there's been a tremendous amount of regenerative activity in my body through the things that I'm eating and the treatments that I've done independently. And we're sitting in a place where my whole body works. My personal functions have come back, not 1000%. But almost completely. I'm nearly independent.
I can take a walker, and stand right up by myself unassisted. Everything moves on my body, everything works. And I'm down to the point where I am looking to get stem cells to get through the last regenerative part of this, get up to my feet and restore the last little bit of my life. I've gotten so many things back, I'm able to get up every day workout at 5am. I'm able to go and now and do some work for the first time and it's been a tremendous success story. It's been wonderful to get everything back that I have. But it's given me that much more desire to get the life that I really had back and we're close. And that's where we're sitting now. I'm really about $50,000 away from a stem cell treatment to completely restore my life. And I think it's going to be a tremendous testimonial to what can be done in terms of recoveries, if you don't necessarily follow the exact same path that everybody else follows. And frankly, I wasn't supposed to move. Frankly, I wasn't supposed to live. I got up this morning, I worked out at 5am, I dressed myself, I went to a job site, and I'm at Lou's office, and I'm talking to you on a podcast. And I'm holding a microphone. And certainly that was never anticipated by anybody.
RJ
That's an amazing recovery story. I was wondering if you could share with the audience, the timeline, what day did this happen to you?
Frank
July 23, 2015. So it was summer there and we're busy at Sachse Construction and waterskiing and just doing all that physical stuff, and I just hurt my back, and then there was a little more than that RJ, it was crazy.
RJ
I know you were going through a lot of stress at that time working up to 20-hour days, to complete projects, you were a principal, and the fairly new company. What have you learned looking back that might have helped you either prevent this or alleviate it?
Frank
Well, I will say this, none of us are indestructible. And if you're doing a superhuman effort for a short period of time, that's one thing, rest and recuperation is important. And you just can't keep the throttle down all the time, and not expect any consequences. I would say two, it was the first time in many years. Like I said it helped to grow Sachse Construction and I was trying to take my experiences there and bring them into another entrepreneurial effort. And I didn't have long term disability for the first time in a decade, really, and you just don't know what's going to happen. It's interesting in the sense that financial planning for a traumatic physical event, how do you manage that in terms of if you don't have disability? How do you protect your wealth? There was a strategy for me, it's like, I decided to spend the money, I believed that I would recover. And then I would believe that I would be able to get up and make more money.
Money is a replaceable commodity, time is not. And if money can fix it, it's not that big problem. I heard once from a pretty wise guy and that's where we're at now. I'm down to the point where money can fix something. And most people aren't. But I would say learning for me is the fundamentals of being insured. And that long term disability is a big deal. But I think that people don't really realize that insurance is only bankruptcy protection. If you're looking to recover from anything substantial, insurance doesn't really cover that anymore for any traumatic event in your life. There's no amount of rehab that they're going to pay for. And it's just strange that it does become a fundraising effort to get somebody healthy. And that may be the case, no matter what. If you're worth 5 million, and you have an injury like I have, you get eaten up if you want to get better. You need to be very strategic.
I think a lot of the pain for me has been watching my family go through the economic pains much more than I've sat around and felt sorry for myself. You want to take your kids and the way that you want to take your kids if you're a father. And when you see them suffering, you kind of go "Wow, should I really spent that money on my recovery? Or should I have been more conservative?"
Somebody would have told me in that hospital that it's going to take you seven years to get out of this chair or eight years. That would have been demoralizing. I couldn't believe that at that time. I believed that I was going to spend 250 grand and I was going to get out of that chair in a year. And now go make another 250 grand. I spent the money because I believed I was going to attack the problem, beat the problem and more money could be made. Would I make that same decision again, seven years later, having watched the suffering that I've watched with my wife and kids? Maybe not, maybe I just stayed right where I was and dealt with it. It's an interesting question.
RJ
Well, Frank, how do you define progress today? You've been at this now for eight years, and now you've got potentially a treatment that would heal you completely or close to 100%. Where are you at today in the process?
Frank
I think it's been a tremendous success, but I'm just admitting that to myself now, for a guy that wasn't supposed to move a finger and for a guy two years ago that had a nurse dress him. I'm doing great. I'm up, I can walk on a walker a little bit. So I feel like I've been a little hard on myself that I haven't completely recovered and I'm not out barefoot waterskiing with my son. But it's really miraculous the progress that I've made, the Stem Cell Institute in Panama. And they've had tremendous success with people like me. Even guys getting rid of their chronic pain as well as their mobility. A lot of MMA people go down there, and a lot of celebrities. I have been interested in that for a number of years. And I felt like that would really finalize this recovery. And then recently, Tony Robbins, of course, came out with his book, Life Force, and the very first chapter, it tells a story about Tony Robbins. He was supposed to have shoulder surgery that absolutely had to happen. And he visited Dr. Neil Riordan, down in Panama. And he wrote his own success story. That's the first chapter of the book, Life force. And a lot of that book echoes a lot of the things that I've been preaching, which are, yes, use all your modern medicine tools to get you out of triage.
Yes, use the modern medicine, regenerative things like stem cell and other. But also diet and holistic. I've had a tremendous amount of recovery that's generated through the use of Rick Simpson oil, which is a cannabis product that is not really used much for recreational cannabis, but I think he's had a tremendous impact on pain management and healing. I've also done a lot of psilocybin experiment, which has reconnected my nerves in a very dramatic and substantial way every time I've done different psilocybin titers. So is really about trying new things, trying new supplements, trying new exercises, new meditations, taking the good. I use the Bruce Lee philosophy, which is, "Take what's good, leave what's bad." Basically now my exercises are a Joe Dispenza meditation with electronic music combined with Tai Chi. I want my muscles moving around vibration. I just use a lot of experimental training, and I see what works. I use part of this, part of that and right now I've got a TRX system that my buddy Joe Gregor bought me and we're putting some units right up above my bed, I have two queen size beds next to each other.
I'm basically starting to do pull ups, pushups, and, fundamental Herschel Walker stuff that's getting me going now, because training is very expensive and insurance doesn't cover it. But recovery is possible and I get better every day. Like I say, when you're watching erosion, you don't see it in the mirror. But then you go, "Well look at that picture two years ago" And I'm just throwing pennies in the well, I'm getting better. And this last little thing we're talking about $50,000 can get a guy out of a chair, walking around, then I'm going to go tell some people that got spinal cord injuries about it and say, "Hey, this isn't a death sentence, you don't necessarily have to keep yourself in shape, technology is improving, and there are other ways." And I feel like I'm really happy but I'm really, really, really going to be happy if I'm waterskiing with my son. To me I always have high standards. I thought I was a loser when I was Vice President of Sachse. I was like, "How the hell am I working for Todd Sachse? I'm a loser."
But apparently that was a pretty good job and Todd is a pretty successful guy. And I'm doing well now by most people standards. I'm a tremendous success story recovering physically. But this chair is not going to hold me RJ. I'm not staying this chair. I'm going to barefoot waterski doubles with my son. I'm going to take a nice picture. And I'm going to help some other people get out of chairs. That's really what I'm trying to do.
RJ
Frank through this whole experience, how have you been able to maintain your mental state and a positive outlook?
Frank
Ah, man, it's a lot of things. One, my Catholic faith and my brothers and sisters. It's interesting. My good friend James Smith always says to me, "You can be fortunate in unfortunate circumstances." When you have your boiler go out and you have no money and you're worried your pipes are going to freeze and your family's cold. That's a horrible thing for a dad to worry about. But then when your buddy shows up, and he puts on your boiler and, and just takes care of it for you, and leaves you there with your house warm it's hard to be sad after that. You're like, "Well, I was going to cry but now they are tears of being happy. So I'm in my house with a new boiler. And that's really been the essence of what's happened is that, every time we have a potentially traumatic, tragic, travesty, whatever it is going on, there's always been people dropping in to help solve our problems, help us work us out of our own problems and that's really been instrumental in and lifting our spirits.
But I think when you're inundated with the kind of trouble that I've had over the last year, I've always thought, Napoleon Hill I read one time said, "A positive thought and a negative thought, cannot occupy the same mind at the same time." So I just change my thought when I can, try to be stoic about it and just come up with strategies to move forward and go, "Okay, this the problem, let's have a little pity party for ourselves, and then we move on. So there are down moments for sure. But I try to put them back together with constructive plans as best I can. And I will say between faith, friends and mindset I've survived,
RJ
What advice would you provide for others that are going through a medical challenge, or some sort of a like challenge?
Frank
They're related, but especially in a medical challenges, appreciate and respect your doctors that are getting you through your trauma, but they are not the only answer. If they are not asking you what food you're putting in your mouth, to help your body heal. What they're doing is a small part of your health recovery, you must be the CEO of your own healthcare recovery. And your doctor is a resource, your diet is a resource, your trainers are a resource, your spirituality is a resource, use all your resources. Don't just believe the medical community is absolutely going to get to your better. And what they know is all to be known. There's a lot of knowledge out there where people can heal and utilize all of it. Do your own tests, don't just believe what you hear.
RJ
Walk us through the recovery with the stem cell procedure. If you get the $60,000 or so would you be going down to Panama, would that be done here?
Frank
We're going to fly down to Panama. And it's, you know, they use American dollars down there. And it's very much like Miami more than anything else, very first world type of experience. And we're going to fly down there, it's about a two week deal where they're going to inject stem cells into the injury. And they work like repairing agents, super repairing agents. So they're going to do that also intravenously that goes throughout the body, and essentially be like about a 10 day process down there. And we'll probably just in case take a little bit of assistance down there to help me get in and out to understand some of it can be a little taxing, but it's about a two week process and hopefully we can get the success we want out of it.
RJ
After that two week process, what did they tell you in terms of recovery, is it months or weeks?
Frank
I think we're talking about a few months recovery after that and working out and training. Is hard to say, everybody's body is going to react a little bit differently, but my expectations are high. If I could get rid of the chronic pain I deal with, that's something. If I could take and instead of being in this electric wheelchair get to a fold up one that I could transfer into a non-handicap van. There's a lot of levels of success. For a guy like me, I couldn't scratch my face for a year. And so you know what I did all the time after that? I scratch my face all the time. If you can't drink a glass of water, and then you can. So if I don't get 100% I get halfway there. It's about moving forward constantly. And I've just been throwing pennies in the well and hopefully this will be more like a shovel full of dirt. And maybe two shovel fulls of dirt and move it forward.
But I'm really feeling my physical condition right now RJ, and you're not seeing me on camera. The dexterity I have in my hands, the way my legs move, my toes, feet and articulate in every possible way that I feel like we were impossible at the beginning and maybe we were impossible five years ago. But you know what? I think impossible right now, if you see me, has moved to inevitable. I don't think this thing is going to hold me much longer. And as that stem cell treatment comes in with the success they've had in so many other people, I feel very confident that I'll be up and walking around after that treatment.
RJ
In addition to researching things on the internet and podcasts, how have you been able to get the word out about what you're going through and what you need to get to a better place?
Frank
We did the fundraising thing three years ago. And it killed me to do fundraising. I never wanted to bother anybody. I just didn't want to ask, I thought I'd make the money and work my way out of this thing rather foolishly. Now I thought again, that I was so close that I wouldn't need to ask again because I feel like everybody has given their time, blood and treasure to this family to get me to where I'm at. And I had hoped that I would be able to just work my way out of it and pay for it. But as a father, you're always going to restore your kids before you take and do some experimental treatment on yourself. And I really have not gone out and asked, and this is sort of the genesis of getting the message out. I've been out sharing my story on Facebook, the last three years I was never on social media. All of a sudden, when I got sick, I took up social media and marijuana at age 46. How about that? Like God almighty, I know that irony.
I haven't asked for fundraising for this yet and this is really the first foray into fundraising for stem cell and completing this recovery. That fundraiser that we did back three years ago it was like, scrape us off the pavement, and just give me the opportunity to train again, some more. And now it's like this is regenerative, and we are really close to getting up. So I think it's just a whole new phase of finishing the recovery, and really having the goal line now in our sight. And now we're getting out there and they're trying to tell it to as many people as we can. And I'm very grateful, certainly to Lou and RJ for listening. We feel like we have the end in sight and we have something that somebody could rally behind and go, "Hey, you know what, this is a really big problem. This is bigger than me. But if I get some help, we can get out of it.” And that's where we're at right now.
RJ
How can folks listening help you? Where can they go?
Frank
We have a 501C3, Help Hope Live, that is taking donations, and we're going to update it with some more current information and pretty pictures. But if you were to go there now, you would see the 300-pound version of me. Hopefully, I'll get some pictures here now with the new restored 180 pound version. But we do have a charity set up that can hand out the tax deductions and such, and we're hoping to get out to the construction community as well. The construction community is certainly a group of people that I have worked with over the last 30 years, get the message out to just whoever would listen, whoever could put themselves in my shoes as a dad to have put their life together and be in their 40s and be like, "Hey, I'm heading in the right direction, and then have something unexpected yet and wipe you out" If anybody that can relate to that, or would want to see somebody like me get a hand up, and be restored back into a productive person, that's the investment that I'm asking for.
RJ
And again, that was Help Hope Live.
Frank
Help Hope Live, yes. Frank Guirlinger at Help Hope Live. And that is a 501C3.
RJ
We will have all that information in our show notes, so that folks can research things on their own and hopefully make contributions to your full recovery. Looking back, what do you think you've learned through this process? And what do you think you could pass on to others that maybe don't know this will be hitting them at some point? And/or they're in the process of some sort of a life challenge?
Frank
Well, I think, there's this medical challenge and there's this stuff that comes to you on surprise. But if you're a busy guy, and you're important, and you are getting 100 emails a day, and everybody needs you. Imagine when the phone stops, and you're just sitting there in the bedroom staring at a ceiling, and you're not useful to anybody. And the people that you used to take care of now are taking care of you. And all that stuff you thought was important, you might want to think about what's important and what's not important, because the world will keep revolving without you. It's really the friends and the family in the relationships that sustain you and the only thing that means anything at the end of the day. Shortly before I got sick, I was in Las Vegas during UFC 100 celebrating my 10th wedding anniversary and I was sitting at a lily pad and I went to Joel Robuchon for dinner and I paid 2100 bucks for dinner. And I spent about five grand that day and I was like, I had a blast because I always have a blast. But I am more thankful and more grateful and happier when I can just go and get Starbucks with my kid for $3 and I'm just so lucky that I got gas in my car and food to eat. And my level of gratitude is 1000 times different. I was always grateful and happy before but little things man, until you can’t drink a glass of water, you don't know how lucky you are to be able to drink a glass of water RJ, that's all I can tell you.
RJ
That's well said. Well, Frank, thank you so much for coming on the show. Really a testament to your strength and your stamina that you're here today and to your family. We wish you the best of luck and anything we can do to help let us know. Again, those links and other information will be provided with this podcast. But thank you so much, Frank.
Frank
Thank you, RJ. Thank you, Lou. I very much appreciate it gentlemen. God bless.